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tv   Closing Bell  CNBC  October 11, 2012 3:00pm-4:00pm EDT

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according to a new report, the nation of australia has the highest per capita in median wealth. probably because they have a giant housing bubble. there's your story. >> oh, that's sour grapes if ever i saw it. wealth per adult is $355,000, second highest in the world after switzerland. >> thanks for watching "street signs," everybody. take care. welcome to the "closing bell." i'm michelle caruso-cabrera in for maria bartiromo. early rally loses steam. now it's a fight to see the bulls or bears get the last word here in the home stretch. >> i'm bill griffeth. if we close lower, this would be the fourth down day in a row for the dow. number five in a row for both the s&p and the nasdaq. technology has been lagging today. apple shares down once again. that stock now flirting with correction levels, meaning it's down almost 10% from its recent all-time high. housing, retail, financial
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stocks have all been under pressure in the last hour or so. we're watching it very carefully. at the high of the day, the dow was up 71 points. it has been drifting lower since that time. virtually unchanged right now at 13,345. the nasdaq up a point right now at 3,052. struggling to remain in positive territory as is the s&p, which is up 2 1/4 points right now. so as the tug-of-war continues in the equity market, let's get predictions on where we go from here. deb is calling for 1500 still on the s&p by the end of the year. >> jim says if romney wins in november, it could actually tank the ek with wequity markets. so what does the rest of the panel think? jim, let me start with you. i think you run contrary to consensus. a lot of folks on wall street think romney might be good. why do you disagree?
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>> because i think that this market rally since june has been about monetary stimulus and little else. and if romney becomes the president, the next fed chairman after bernanke's term expires in january '14 will be decidely more hawkish than what we have now. if bernanke does not get reappointed, we'll get another dove. >> what do you think about that, todd? your view is as long as the fed's in that market, so are you. >> that's right. i have to say with a romney victory, i think it's great on both sides of the table. jim is right. when bernanke's term comes due in january 2014, chances are he's not going to be asked back. however, with lower taxes, you'll have people going out to spend money. that helps earnings. that helps the fundamental argument. stocks are going to do great either way. >> debra, what do you think? >> i would tend to agree that if we have obama staying in that the market will be under
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pressure next year because now they're not worried so much about re-election. they don't have to worry so much about making friends with everyone, that they can go back to doing what maybe they need to do, which is back off on the fed. if we lose that fed juice, then the market could pull back. but that's next year. i think right now going into the end of the year, i think the market's going to do quite well. >> you're not worried about the fiscal cliff? some people have -- goldman sachs and morgan stanley have specifically looked at the fiscal cliff and said it's decidedly problematic for the fourth quarter and the s&p could fall from here. >> that's if the fiscal cliff happens. i really don't think they're going to let that happen. i think we'll see the same kind of drama we saw around government shutdown where is they tiptoe and dance all the way up until the last minute and then get it done. we already know they're having meetings right now figuring out the end to that crisis. so i think that we're going to build it up and build it up and it's all going go away. i really think that what we're going to see with this market right now is a continuation of
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this slow, steady, up trend. there's no real reason right now to take it out. >> rick, what do you think? how about the 30-year treasury auction today? a lot soft, but i guess that would be expected at that yield, right? >> yeah, well, i think it was a bit soft for sure. the post-auction, all the auctions being done really gave us a big rally afterwards. the best way to get a dugout filli ined with varying personalities is to pick a new manager. i think if we pick a new manager, that will lead into the fiscal cliff being changed in a way that won't give us the big hiccup in the market. i also agree with jim though. i think what could happen is if mitt wins, there's going to be a big rally. then there's going to be an interim period where thoughts of the fed are going to crop in, and i think it gives up a little ground. i think it's going to be a little bit of both. >> jim, i'm pretty skeptical. i know what romney has said about what he thinks the federal reserve is doing and what he said about ben bernanke.
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but have you ever met a politician who would resist the fed making their life easier? i mean, give me a break. it's just not in their nature. >> oh, there's no doubt that, you know, the hawkish name i was thinking of is john taylor being a name bantered about. he could also go with a glen hubbard. someone who would be a lot more market friendly. then all the sudden this talk of a hawkish debate could be december pate dissipated. i think if the market was planning on qe open ended for years and years as bernanke was saying, what could change that? a romney presidency could change that. you'd have to start factoring in a different kind of fed if a romney presidency looks more likely in the coming weeks. >> let's get back to the marks here as we go into this final hour. todd, what are you doing right
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now? >> i'm buying right now, bill. i'll tell you what, you'd be a fool to stay on the sidelines right now. there's some great sectors right there. you really want to concentrate on growth, maybe in the recovering economy, maybe a romney presidency. whatever you want to say. you could look at consumer discretionary names. they should do wonderful, especially with fed accommodation. history has shown us previous times, consumer discretionary stocks did exceptionally well. overall the stock market should do great next year. you can look at the fed argument. you can look at fundamental analysis. both sides support a bullish signal. >> so the four down days we've had here, the five, you see this as a buying opportunity? >> absolutely. build up the war chest. a great entry point into equities. >> debra, you're right in there with him, aren't you? >> absolutely. it pains me to know how many people have missed this rally, that they pulled so much money out of equity funds. the people that stayed in equity funds have gone into the
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dividend funds. they've gone into the index funds. it breaks your heart to see that so many people have left so many profits on the table. >> rick santelli, were you surprised at the strength of the euro, even after the downgrades overnight by moody's and s&p on spain? >> no, you know what, i think between the euro, the yen, and the dollar that we're just going to bounce back and forth because these countries all have similar problems. you're not going to see a true relative value argument showing up in any currency. as far as the magic carpet ride of qes, i think they're showing some grass stains as we bump against the ground, and missed opportunity is the last war that's being fought. just like ben bernanke's last war is not the same issues in the depression as we have today. take more politician and go smoke a pipe. you said that last time. it makes no sense. i'm the anti-politician of all time. wake up!
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>> i'm a trader. i'm just trying to make money. >> i'm an ex-trader too. i don't sound like a politician. politicians don't usually tell the truth. >> todd, as we try to make money here, you're not nervous about the fact every single day here we seem to fade into the close. the industrial struggling to hold on to positive territory again. >> well, you're right, michelle. a great run in the markets though going into the week. all year long the markets have been outperforming what we all expected. going forward, if i see this as a weakness, it's a great buying opportunity. if earnings period -- if that gives us more of a pullback, that would be a great opportunity to build up that war chest and go long. >> all right. thank you, all. nice to talk with you. see you later. that was fun. >> there are 51 minutes before the closing bell. the dow industrial average is struggling to stay in positive territory. it's higher by just a little more than 1 1/2 points right now. >> you'll want to stick around
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for that. you also don't want to miss what's ahead on this thursday edition of the "closing bell." watch. coming up, feeling the pinch. luxury stocks getting a mark down in china. is this a sign of things to come? why what happens in china might not be staying in china. plus, bank on it. some say as financials go, so go the markets. so where are they going? telling signs are straight ahead. and -- >> where's the beef? >> or what's the point? wendy's undergoes a logo change. will it help take a bite out of mcdonald's dominant market share? that's all ahead on the "closing bell."
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welcome back. a little over 45 minutes left in the trading session. if you're just joining us, time for a quick market stat check. we're still looking for the first up day of the week. stocks erasing gains around
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midday after a u.s. appeals court overturned a legal ruling that had initially favored apple. that stock continues lower as does the rest of the market. the dow up just five points right now at 13,350. the dow was up 95 at the day's highs. telecoms have been trading lower in a tug-of-war with energies and financials, which have generally been higher. >> more and more companies blame a china slow down for their weak profit outlooks. something we heard from big conglomerates such as berburbeb demand has weakened there. >> and yesterday, international paper ceo told us on "closing
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bell" he believes china is slowing far more than people think. >> i think china's growing at something far less than 7%. they've slowed down, and it feels more to us like 2 or 3%. things like electric power consumption in china is flat. that ought to be a good indicator of the level of economic activity. i do think it will come back though. >> well, he had to add that at the end. that's still 2 to 3% growth he believes in china right now. it's startling. china's slowdown reverberates through the rest of the global economy. so how are companies offsetting this tremendous head wind, or can they right now? stacy says it remains a key problem for luxury retailers. adam says it is a short-term issue for multinationals as well. stacy, you remain negative on the luxury retailers right now because of that slowdown in china, right? >> i do, but bill, it's probably for a different reason than the
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obvious. we know mainland china is slowing down. you just summed it up with all those companies that made negative comments. nike was the latest to pile on. what i'm worried about is the luxury players that have exposure in europe to a large extent. 20 to 50% of the business in europe is being made up by chinese tourism. that's something to think about as that slows. >> like who? >> well, for example, burberry was the first to sound the warning alarm saying that tourism into europe is slowing. sure, we had the olympics. that was a bit of a disruption in london, but you have exposure with tiffany. you have exposure with fossil. >> when it comes to tiffany, their flag ship store on 5th avenue, i remember some statistic related to foreigners and the purchases they made there. it's pretty dramatic. >> it's huge. it's about 40%. >> 40% of the sales on that 5th
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avenue store come from tourists? >> they do. you have to watch out for that chinese tourist slowing. >> adam, when you think about the global economy, you think about the multinationals. you view them cautiously optimistic, right? >> that's right p. i don't want to sugar coat the issue. you have production slowing, some bad manufacturing numbers. nonetheless, china is one piece of the pie, certainly, that companies especially exposed to construction are going to feel the pinch from. we have a nice positive situation going on in u.s. housing, u.s. automotive, and even areas like brazil are starting to pick up. we still think there are opportunities for growth for many multinational industrial firms. >> it's not that you agree china is slowing, you just think there's enough offset. you think the renewed strength in housing in the united states is enough? >> for some companies, it will be enough.
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for companies like caterpillar, it may not be. that's a fair point. about half of caterpillar's operating profits now come from mining equipment, which although directly not sold to china, it is sold into areas like australia and south america as a result of commodity prices. the lower commodity prices that we've seen because of china's slowdown has led to delays in miner's capital expenditure plans. >> stacey, is there anything you'd buy right now in the categories we've been talking about? >> i think there are a few companies that have big expos e exposure? europe like ralph lauren. but they don't have the exposure to the asian tourism. lastly, coach. it was really a self-inflicted couponing problem in their factory outlet. i think that's a stock to look at.
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certainly that's an underdog here. micha micha michael. >> explain what a couponing problem is. >> they took it away. >> sorry about that. they did. what coach did in their factory outlets, they took away coupe up -- coupons from their customers. they realized the factory outlet system is very driven by coupons. don't take that drug away from your consumer. >> jcpenney did the very same thing. what did they do today? they reimplemented their coupon system. >> adam, caterpillar and 3m, those are your picks? >> we think the market is pricing a lot of that already. it's trading a cheap multiple. has a great dividend yield. 3m on the other hand is more
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defensive. probably a little less upside. we think that stock is worth about $100. again, a great dividend yield. very well diversified company. no one division accounts for more than 10% of their sales. >> all right. thank you, both. interesting discussion. talk to you soon. >> thank you. see you soon. >> thank you. >> you're right. a lot of tourists go to tiffany's to buy their souvenirs. that's an expensive souvenir. myself, i'd go to 8th avenue and buy a t-shirt. >> i love new york. >> exactly. we got 40 minutes left in the trading day. it is a squeaker. will we be positive for the first time this week? right now the dow is virtually unchanged. >> so washington may not get it, but the authors of the simpson-bowles tax plan say the american people do get it. >> for generations we've asked our politicians to bring home the bacon. well, the pig is dead. >> we're going get reaction to that incredible exclusive interview coming up. >> that was great. i hope you got to see that today with steve liesman. also, pc sales plunging in
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the third quarter. should you avoid a stock like, say, hewlett-packard at all cost and instead bet on microsoft, which is about to release its latest version of windows? or will a bad pc market even hurt microsoft as well? also ahead, the viral video coca-cola doesn't want you to see. an ad world legend has turned a bashing of coke out. someone says it's not so truthful. [ male announcer ] the 2013 smart comes with 8 airbags, a crash management system and the world's only tridion safety cell which can withstand over three and a half tons. small in size. big on safety.
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the nasdaq struggling to stay positive right now. you can blame apple again for that. the stock now flirting with correction territory again. seema mody is at the nasdaq with the details. >> that's right. take a look at the stock. shares of apple weighing o n th nasdaq. what's more important is it is roughly down 10% from hitting that all-time intraday high of 705 back on september 21st, which basically means it's getting very close to correction territory. of course, the big question, what's the catalyst? has it gone up just so much that now investors are booking profits? does it have to do with some of the concerns around the iphone 5 and its sales so far? we have about 30 minutes left in trade, and the stock trading down by around 1.5%.
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back to you. >> seema, thank you. let's say in technology. it seems a pair of seemingly bad headlines are doing little to pour cold water on hewlett-packard. the stock is higher despite a report that says china's lenovo may have overtaken hp in pc sales in the last quarter. pc sales themselves had their biggest decline in more than ten years. so do you dare touch hp right now, or is the better bet microsoft? on hopes that windows 8 might revive that industry. let's talk numbers on those two companies. on the technical side, mark newton of gray wolf execution partners. on the fundamentals side, erin gibbs. erin, i'm going to start with you. which company do you feel benefits more from the release of windows right now, microsoft or hp? >> microsoft, without a doubt. microsoft will be able to take advantage of the windows 8 release not only from an increase in pc sales but also from any additional sales in the
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tablets and smart phones base. so it's really positioned well for transitions. it did extremely well in its transition from windows 7. we expect the same thing. >> so you would buy microsoft here? >> yes. >> you would not by hp? >> no, and for many reasons. >> well, there are other issues facing that company. that was an emphatic no from her. what about you, mark, on the charts? >> i agree with erin here. i like microsoft a lot better than hp over the next couple months. you see a chart of hp. really since april of 2010, the stock hast 20% in value. it's been a steep down trend. >> and through three ceos in that time. >> despite being oversold, you need to see some sign of stabilization before you can step in and buy. you can't just say the stock is oversold and you need to buy it. it's now nearing 2002 lows near $11. that's an area that's a better
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area to step in and buy if you want to bottom fish. >> so you're not catching that falling spear, as they say. >> i think it's much too early. microsoft is in much better shape. it's been a relative outperformer. >> almost like a mirror image. >> well, the stock really over the last couple years has been a lot lbetter in terms of how it' trended. the stock has gradually shown a sign of higher lows and really higher highs. a lot of people remember the stock as having gone nowhere for the last ten years. it moved to new highs. it's backing down. it's giving people an opportunity to buy. i'd look at microsoft near 27 1/2 to 28 1/2 as being a strong area of support. >> okay. microsoft the winner over hp in today's "talking numbers." >> the dow jones industrial average is higher by 1 357.5 po. still maintaining positive territory, as is the nasdaq. banking on earnings. jap morgan chase and wells fargo
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are going to lead tomorrow's parade of financial results. is the market's fate hanging on those numbers? that's next. and pay very close attention if you work on wall street. why your phone conversations could end up sending you to prison. it's later on the "closing bell." and don't forget to watch the vice presidential debate here on cnbc at 7:00 eastern time. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 when i'm trading, i'm totally focused. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and the streetsmart edge trading platform from charles schwab... tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 gives me tools that help me find opportunities more easily. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 i can even access it from the cloud and trade on any computer. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 and with schwab mobile, tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 i can focus on trading anyplace, anytime... tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 until i choose to focus on something else. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 trade at charles schwab for $8.95 a trade. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 open an account and trade up to tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 6 months commission-free online equity trading tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 with a $50,000 deposit. tdd#: 1-800-345-2550 call 1-866-294-5412. throughout our lives.
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the financial sector has been red hot in recent months helping fuel the broad market rally. how will the bank stocks do, and wh -- in what is expected to be a tepid earnings season. here's a preview of the earnings. >> bank stocks have seen a big rally. investors, though, are still worried of the anemic deal volumes. no one would dispute that earnings are up from the crisis. earnings growth for banks has been trapped in a very tight range. take a look at this graph. you see that taper off, and it's not going anywhere but staying pretty flat. external factors appear not to be able to push toward a breakout any time soon. in fact, investors are bracing
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for more head winds. tomorrow, wells fargo and jpmorgan will be the first to defend this sector. for wells, analysts expect 87 cents a share on $21.5 billion in revenue. wells could get the biggest lift of all the banks from the housing market. that boost could be offset by declines in net interest margins. jpmorg jpmorgan could be affected by issues in london. furth finally, any smoke signals from alcoa ceo who will lead tomorrow's call. we're still waiting for news on his departure, when that will happen, and who his successor will be. >> maybe we'll find out tomorrow. thanks very much.
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since the financial crisis, the banks have led this market higher and lower. they've been a leading market indicator. matt, since the crisis, it's gone the way of technology. these bank earnings, are they going to lead the market higher? >> i don't think you're going to see the bank earnings lead the market higher. when you look to last year, you've seen bank earnings within the s&p up year over year roughly 47%. they're getting that from taking loan loss reserves and selling off non-core assets. i don't think they're real. when when you look at the revenue growth, it's still negative about 5%. i expect jpmorgan and wells fargo to beat tomorrow on mortgages. i think it's time to take some profits in the money center
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banks, go to the regional banks. they've underperformed since august by roughly 500 basis points. i would be select nif choosing in this environment. >> i guess you'd be selling then because you like the banks. why? >> i think that when you look at some of the large banks, you have rebound in capital market activity. these are banks that generally have taken their cost structures down. you've got a little bit of leverage going on as we speak. i think that's one of the main reasons. >> are you worried about all of these lawsuits? quarter of quarter, just when you think the litigation may be coming to an end, poof, there's more. this is, like, phillip morris of the old days. you're not worried about that? >> we're certainly concerned about it. i think what jpmorgan has done is taken litigation reserves, sometimes smaller amounts and sometimes larger amounts -- >> but that costs money and hurts profits, right? >> it does. but in general, they've beaten analyst expectations even with
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that. we've got $.5 billion litigation reserve in our estimates for the third quarter. we're at $1.37 well above the consensus. it could even be larger, and they could still beat consensus. >> matt, specifically to wells fargo, the housing market does seem to be improving. jpmorgan seems to be getting their act together, the london whale notwithstanding. why wouldn't you like companies like that right now necessarily? >> i look at it this way, bill. i think everybody who's refied has already done it. i think banks are reluctant to lend. i don't want to buy banks for a mortgage play. i don't like the casino aspect of jpmorgan. i like more organic plays like regiona regionals. these are conservative banks. they have better management. they don't have the headline risk that michelle is talking about. i don't like buying companies that have huge litigation reserves. i like companies that it don't have to have litigation reserves. i like companies with big dividends. i feel comfortable owning them in a very choppy environment.
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>> you clearly disagree. what names would you recommend? >> we like both jpmorgan and citigroup here. i think there's definitely some risk, but i think jpmorgan's earned between 13 and 16% on equity pretty much every quarter for the last couple years. they've done a pretty good job doing that. >> all right, gentlemen. thank you, both, very much. jpmorgan chase, wells fargo out with earnings tomorrow morning. should set the tone for the day. thanks for being with us. all right. let's get to jackie deangelis with this market flash. >> hey, bill. watching two stocks of interest here. 1 navistar is the first one, coming off its highs, after hearing they're not interested in combining with oshkosh. also want to check in on shares of jcpenney, trading higher. their highest since january, in fact. this is after a key supplier, levi strauss, that said their
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stores within the chain are doing quite well. >> there's that coupon play. they're back again. thank you, jackie. heading toward the close with about 25 minutes left. the bulls are struggling mightily to keep this market in positive territory for the first time this week. >> stocks are now lower for october though. up next, why someone says it is time to be brave when it comes to investing. >> s also, i hope you saw this interview today. goldman sachs ceo issuing a dire warning about the fiscal cliff. >> for the people who are the most are consequences, namely people like ourselves who are advisers to companies who have to live in the economy, we sure know what the consequence will be. it will be awful. >> also, foreclosures falling to a five-year low, but somebody here says thanks to washington, housing may soon get a lot worse. back in a moment.
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welcome back. we've seen a lot of milestones recently. today it's happening in the natural gas markets. sharon here with details. >> bill, we're looking at new highs for the year for natural gas right now, even electronic trading natural gas continues to move higher. that after we got a report on storage levels from the energy
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department. we could see escalating demand coming particularly this winter and with power production. then we could see prices going into next year at $5. that's what morgan stanley is saying. meanwhile, in terms of heating oil, that's the story in the oil complex. that is the focus as we turn to winter fuels. we are looking at distillate fuel supplies down 21% from where they were a year ago. the energy department saying we're going to pay the highest home heating bills this winter. not happy about that. >> lovely. thank you very much. so stocks are looking to avoid a five-day losing streak. either way, have no fear. even though many on the street have issued bleak earnings outlooks, goldman sachs and citigroup are putting out bullish calls right now. >> goldman is boosting its third quarter earnings estimates. both firms raising the s&p 500 price targets for next year, 1575 and 1650 respectively.
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>> big numbers. >> goldman is negative for the rest of the year on this year. good to have you here. tell us, what are your expectations here for earnings season, and do they matter that much, or should we be more worried about the fiscal cliff and the election outcome? >> i think the earnings matter, but not a particularly great extent. we go into the earnings season with significant reductions leading up to this with broad consensus expectations calling for margin decline and negative sales growth. i actually don't think companies will have a particularly difficult time achieving earnings for this quarter. i don't expect positive guidance as uncertainty remains significant. >> steve, what do you think? we are heading into the sweet spot of the earnings season. what are your expectations here? >> i agree. the earnings are going to look good.
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profit margins are high. the guidance is not going to be good. a lot of analysts are adjusting and coming out with new estimates for 2013. it's usually predicated on a 3% gdp kind of number. i think this year a lot of the estimates for next year are not going as bullish as they have been. i think he was kind of indicating earnings estimates may be too high for next year. i think they are. it's not a great situation for stocks, but since earnings are growing, it should be good for stocks. right now for the next couple of months, as you see revisions come down for next year, not for the quarter but next year, i wouldn't expect stocks to do that well. >> bob, how do we reconcile that cautiousness with some of the forecasts for the next year when the s&p from goldman sachs or citi or other groups see it going as high as 1650. >> that's exactly the point. everybody's worried, and they're raising their numbers. are they insane or what?
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there's two things going on. number one, qe-3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8. we don't know how much higher the market is as a result of fed's action, but it is higher. number two, feorget about 13 or 14 multiples. if europe calms down, there are people arguing we should have a higher multiple like 15. if you have 15 on the s&p right now at 105, $108 earnings next year, you're at 1600 easy. it's easy to sort of make the argument at this point. >> we're talking very long term here. tell us what you think of what's happened this week. is this problematic at all? we're struggling to stay positive. we've had a long week here of losing every single day nearly. is that a signal of something that's going to come here in the short term? are we walking into a big correction? >> i mean, i think it would be hard to extrapolate any one trend. i think for now given the uncertainty about next year, and as steve pointed out, given the
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estimates are still too high for next year, i don't expect us to break out of a trading range. the market has been very, very short-term focused for the last three or four years. i really don't see that changing because partly we don't have a framework for thinking about what the solution looks like. in the meantime, we'll continue to be data driven, liquidity is good, markets go up, earnings are okay, you'll probably be in the trading change now. >> what are you going to buy here, steve? >> you had sharon on before we got started here talking about natural gas. we try to think about going into a megatrend. natural gas reminds me of copper eight years ago. no one is interested. the price is very low. companies are cash flow, break even at 350 natural gas. if natural gas can stay at 5, there's a lot of money to be made, not only on the producers but a lot of technology companies that can translate natural gas into other fuels that are useful for maybe automobiles and other things. i think there's a megatrend. i think it's natural gas. i think it's now time to visit that group.
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>> morgan stanley made a huge bullish call on natural gas today. that's why all the natural gas stocks are up as well. they thought it could go to $5. >> what's your best idea? >> i hate to be so civil, but we are overweight energy as well as health care and consumer cyclicals. it's believed the oil price will also continue to rise from these levels. in case of health care, you're getting reasonably attractively valued stocks with significant opportunity for improving dividend yield. >> all right. thank you, gentlemen, for a polite, civil conversation on the markets. we'll see you later. steve, see you on the countdown coming up. >> 15 minutes before the closing well. is it going to be polite and civil as we head to the close? the dow is right now lower by six points. so in negative territory once again. >> the authors of simpson-bowles warning politicians today they're about to feel the wrath of the american people for not
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working together to make a deal on our debt. listen. >> people are going to say to their elected representatives, look, i had to pay more interest because you guys didn't do anything. i'm getting it stuck right and left. you did this to me, now correct it. >> we'll talk about who's getting in the way of fixing this mess straight ahead. also, wendy's cooking up a brand new logo for the first time in 30 years. when you see it, you might ask, why bother? is it all that different? we'll show it to you next.
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it is our version of the big three. earlier today, steve liesman had that wonderful exclusive interview with goldman sachs chairman and ceo and the co-chairs of the national commission on fiscal responsibility. namely allen simpson and erskine bowles. here's some of that port conversation. >> the ax is going to swing and the club is going to come down, and people are going to say to their elected representatives,
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look, i had to pay more interest because you guys didn't do anything. i'm getting it stuck right and left, and you did this to me, and now go correct it. >> the american people are way ahead of the politicians. >> way ahead. >> they know we've got a problem. they want those politicians to stand up and get the job done. >> if they know it, why are we in round three of supposedly getting it fixed? >> because those two aren't there to solve the problem. i mean, they harken back to a time of political civility that existed in washington for years. i mean, we're all thinking back to the days of ronald reagan and tip o'neill who were about as far apart politically as you could get, but they were able to come together and find common ground on some of the thorny issues that existed economically in the 1980s. that's not happening today because so many of the politicians view these issues as defining who they are personally. they take it personally, and that's a problem right now. don't you think? >> yeah, i think so. i also think that we're at a
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very different moment. when we talk about the kind of spending back then, we were arguing a lot about defense spending under ronald reagan. >> absolutely. >> we really needed to be arguing more about entitlement spending, which never got taken care of. now we have this huge, huge problem where people expect so much. they've been promised things. that's what makes it extremely difficult. >> let's face it. the stakes are much, much higher now. the zeros we're talking about -- >> are huge. >> have a "t" in front of them. we're talking trillions of dollars on an annual basis right now. by the way, more of steve's interview in the coming 30 minutes. >> wait until you hear what they say will cost people their jobs. >> by the way, as wall street struggles to clean up its image, an iconic fast food company is changing its image. >> wendy's unveiling its first new logo in 29 years. there it is on the right. the little girl with red pigtails getting a modern makeover. that seems a little retro, right? >> all right. in undertaking the design, i'm
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reading about the whole thing. this was very scientific. they realized there were three key elements that had to remain the same, the image of the little girl, the color red -- we all know red is the color used by all fast food chains. for some reason, it's appetizing. you go to the places that are colored red. >> mcdonald's, burger king, they're all red. >> pizza hut. and they needed the winendy's lo to swerve upward. it made it more inviting. the pigtails had to stay on the little girl. >> if those are the three crucial things, they then went with a minimalist approach. that's all that's left. >> that's all that's left. the old-fashioned logo that dave thomas implemented 30 years ago is gone now. >> but it's the essence is still there. >> it's still there. don't worry, the hamburgers are still square. >> and they're delicious. coming up next, we're going to come right back with the closing countdown. also, you know coke's famous polar bears? a new parody says that drinking all that sugar has given them
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diabetes and things like -- >> erectile dysfunction. bill won't say it on television. >> i'm a golfer. i don't do the word shank either. the consumer advocacy group that commissioned the ad explains exclusively why this is no laughing matter. and what does the this ship and the african country of ghana have in common? you're going to have to stick around to hear the details of this incredible financial story. [ horn honks ] hey, it's sandra -- from accounting. peter. i can see that you're busy... but you were gonna help us crunch the numbers for accounts receivable today. i mean i know that this is important. well, both are important. let's be clear. they are but this is important too. [ man ] the receivables. [ male announcer ] michelin knows it's better for xerox to help manage their finance processing. so they can focus on keeping the world moving. with xerox, you're ready for real business. so they can focus on keeping the world moving.
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mike rowe here at a ford tell me fiona, who's having a big tire event? your ford dealer. who has 11 major brands to choose from? your ford dealer. who's offering a rebate? your ford dealer. who has the low price tire guarantee... affording peace of mind to anyone who might be in the market for a new set of tires? your ford dealer. i'm beginning to sense a pattern. buy four select tires, get a $60 rebate. use the ford service credit credit card, get $60 more. that's up to $120. where did you get that sweater vest? your ford dealer. [ male announcer ] how do you turn an entrepreneur's dream... ♪ into a scooter that talks to the cloud? ♪ or turn 30-million artifacts... ♪ into a high-tech masterpiece? ♪ whatever your business challenge, dell has the technology and services to help you solve it.
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and his new boss told him two things -- cook what you love, and save your money. joe doesn't know it yet, but he'll work his way up from busser to waiter to chef before opening a restaurant specializing in fish and game from the great northwest. he'll start investing early, he'll find some good people to help guide him, and he'll set money aside from his first day of work to his last, which isn't rocket science. it's just common sense. from td ameritrade.
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four minutes left in the trading session here. the order and balances were to the downside. looks like we're going to finish with four straight down days for the dow, and it'll be five in a refor t row for the nasdaq and s&p. >> look at where we were earlier in the morning. >> 95 at the high of the day. where was the strength? where was the weakness inside the dow? bank of america has been the leader today, but a gain of 1.5% there as we get ready for the earnings onslaught. and disney, that suit filed by stanley media. they claim they have the rights to things like spider-man and
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iron man. so disney stock has suffered as a result, down 1.5%. the stock of the day, really, probably is going to be apple, which continues lower and is heading toward correction territory here. down almost 2% today at $629 after touching $700 not too long ago. steve still with us. ben willis is joining us. what about apple? >> apple is a big deal. it's 10% of most growth funds holdings. it's 5% of the s&p. it's coming near its 100-day moving average. if you hit the headlines for the news today on apple, all negative news. arguments with samsung, problems with their factory in foxcon. a lot of analysts lowering estimates into the quarter as there might be a delay in delivering iphone 5 because of production problem. it's leading the market. everyone is looking at this 100-day moving average.
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>> ben, is that the problem this week? we've had a problem this week. four days in a row. we just can't manage to hold to the upside. is it apple, or is it more than that? >> if you're a bear, it's not a problem. >> that's a good point. i'm assuming most of the audience is long, but you're right. >> the whole market is in a corrective phase. we were inflated by the hot air of the central banks and their bazookas or whatever you want to call them. the market needs to correct itself. it needs to happen. >> why, just because it was time? >> it was ahead of itself. the market was way ahead of itself. we reached expectations of most strategists in september that strategists had projected in december. the market was way ahead of itself. it needs to pull back. it's not uncommon in wall street to have the pendulum swing too far. >> but i want it to go up every day. >> tomorrow we get earnings from jpmorgan and from wells fargo. that could set the tone for the day. what are you expecting? >> the bank stocks are unusual.
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the one thing we'll be looking for is the long lost reserves that are being set aside. the financials saw strength today. i thought that had a lot to do with the conversation coming out of the eu on relaxing the basil requirements that gave the lift to financials in particular. >> they might delay that by as much as a year. do you like the financials, steve? >> i think america is up because they're playing the trade into jpmorgan. everyone overowns that stock. the next derivative play is bank of america. the fed is pumping money into the economy via banks, mortgage-backed securities. their balance sheets are going to look great. positive comments on bank of america and other financials. that's the long trade. >> we've had this conversation before. all the litigation risk. i used to say every week. it's every morning we wake up to some new piece. >> as a whole, litigation costs have been set aside for the most part by all the financials. that's well


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